I'm sure many of you remember the old Marvel vs DC comics from the 90s. Five of the matches were fan voted and 6 were not. I wanted to start a discussion on how you all feel the fights should have gone. Do you agree with what was published or do you disagree?

Fan voted fights:

Hulk vs Superman - Superman won after a hard battle and black eyes.

Storm vs Wonder Woman - Storm won this one by continually pelting WW with lightening bolts.

Spider-Man vs Superboy - Spider-Man was the victor in a pretty boring fight

Wolverine vs Lobo - Wolverine won a ridiculous off panel victory.

Captain America vs Batman - Batman won on a fluke when a water main broke and he hit the distracted Cap in the head with a batarang after a fight that had lasted hours.

Non fan vote fights:

Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an Orca on Namor.

Jubilee vs Robin - Robin won by tricking her with his cape.

Quicksilver vs Flash - Flash won this one even after Pietro sucker punched him after Flash stopped to save a kid and his dad from death.

Thor vs Shazam - Thor won by disrupting the lightening that gave CM his power with Mjolnir.

Silver Surfer vs Green Lantern - Silver Surfer won after a cataclysmic clash of power.

Elektra vs Catwoman - Elektra absolutely schooled Catwoman here. Dropped her off a building.

Punstarr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sure many of you remember the old Marvel vs DC
> comics from the 90s. Five of the matches were fan
> voted and 6 were not. I wanted to start a
> discussion on how you all feel the fights should
> have gone. Do you agree with what was published
> or do you disagree?
>
> Fan voted fights:
>
> Hulk vs Superman - Superman won after a hard
> battle and black eyes.

They never let Hulk get mad.



> Storm vs Wonder Woman - Storm won this one by
> continually pelting WW with lightening bolts.

Velveeta.



> Spider-Man vs Superboy - Spider-Man was the victor
> in a pretty boring fight

Clone vs. clone...


> Wolverine vs Lobo - Wolverine won a ridiculous off
> panel victory.

Lobo should have shucked Wolverine's flesh off of his arm bones like a banana peel and picked his teeth with a claw.

> Captain America vs Batman - Batman won on a fluke
> when a water main broke and he hit the distracted
> Cap in the head with a batarang after a fight that
> had lasted hours.

That the fight lasted hours was a highlight. That Batman pressed a distraction advantage for the win is nice, especially doing it without government-issue steroids.


> Non fan vote fights:
>
> Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an Orca
> on Namor.

Namor should have won this.


> Jubilee vs Robin - Robin won by tricking her with
> his cape.

Robin won, and got some interdimensional love on.


> Quicksilver vs Flash - Flash won this one even
> after Pietro sucker punched him after Flash
> stopped to save a kid and his dad from death.

Quicksilver never had a chance.

> Thor vs Shazam - Thor won by disrupting the
> lightening that gave CM his power with Mjolnir.

Oh boy. Thor defeated a child.

> Silver Surfer vs Green Lantern - Silver Surfer won
> after a cataclysmic clash of power.

Makes sense.

> Elektra vs Catwoman - Elektra absolutely schooled
> Catwoman here. Dropped her off a building.

Elektra is the more highly trained fighter.




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2009 06:57PM by Dead Sidekick.

I remember this debate between Marvel and DC Characters… But I can’t remember what publication…

The main thing I recall was the mock-up competitions were more based upon Publication Popularity and Character Archetypes more so than the Characters Power Sets and Gaming Abilities…


Superman -=VS=- Hulk:
Frankly, I could see Superman winning this one both RPG wise and in Publication Popularity…. I feel the final epic battle would be Superman helping Hulk while he is Bruce Banner… While the 2 would have some pretty nasty fights and a huge wake of destruction… Eventually, Superman would figure out what Hulk needs to stay calm and use his Powers for a positive outlet….


Storm -=VS=- Wonder Woman:
RPG wise this one is difficult to call and after say 1000 Battles I’d see Wonder Woman being the victor at probably 501 to 505 Wins over Storm…. Mainly because Wonder Woman is about as Powerful as Superman…. But Storm would draw blood first and dominate the first group of battles…… Wonder Woman is like the Fabled Tiger in Chinese Literature…. Tigers don’t fight back until they get hurt ‘BAD’..

Publication and Popularity wise Storm is the current ‘HOT’ thing because she has more human appeal and is generally depicted as ‘Sexy yet Approachable’……. Wonder Woman is more of the Amazon Warrior Goddess Chic, and while Sexy, she is not Approachable by mortal men and has generally lost her Publication Appeal…


Spider-Man -=VS=- Superboy:
Another difficult one to call…. I’d say these 2 would have the same results as Storm -=VS=- Wonder Woman…. Probably why Spider-Man’s and Supa-Boy’s Fights were rather dull and uneventful… The entire scenario was already played… Only now instead of two hot Women the reader gets two Young Adult men…. And generally in Western Culture nobody cares about Young Adult Men…. Young Men are strong and can plow their own destiny…. And Young Adult Men tend to fight each other anyway in a very ending circle…


Wolverine -=VS=- Lobo:
The whole panel review of Marvel -=VS=- DC Characters was more of a argument of which Publication nailed the Personality Archetype correctly….. Personality wise these two are nearly identical… Grizzled Up Mean SOBs who were outcast and developed a major antisocial complex and would rather beat the dog snot out of the Status Que…… Yet at the end of the battle they show something novel about their Personality… Honor, Humility, Loyalty, Courage… all that Good Crap that makes Grand-Pa have a tear because he experienced it in WWII, or NAM, or Korea or Whatever War….

RPG wise… Ridiculous, Lobo’s Power level is equal to Superman… Wolverine is basically a normal human with some add-ons…


Cap’n America -=VS=- Batman:
Once again, this match up is more of an argument of which Publication nailed the Persona Archetype correctly….. RPG wise both of these guys could twirl round in round forever and never have a definitive victor…. Just Batman is Privately funded and Cap’n America is Government funded…

But Batman wins the Popularity Contest…. Feature Length Movies with A-Tier Actors, Video Games, 1000’s of Cartoons produced in every language, and Millions more Publication Pages….

Ask some random rice farmer dood in Shin-Lo-Boo-Pok South Cambodia…. He’s even seen ‘BATMAN’

DAYUM that's a long post..... Just get on roll and can't stop...

Punstarr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sure many of you remember the old Marvel vs DC
> comics from the 90s. Five of the matches were fan
> voted and 6 were not. I wanted to start a
> discussion on how you all feel the fights should
> have gone. Do you agree with what was published
> or do you disagree?
>
> Fan voted fights:
>
> Hulk vs Superman - Superman won after a hard
> battle and black eyes.

I always pick Hulk. But as all of the voted fights went, popularity wins. Supes is simply more popular!
>
> Storm vs Wonder Woman - Storm won this one by
> continually pelting WW with lightening bolts.

Storm only needs to play keep away and she gets the win. She did it here and I don't see what the big deal is? In hand to hand combat Storm is very formidable, but she loses in skill. strength and speed to WW. She only was shown using her advantages to get the win (while getting the popular vote too!). I think it would have been more entertaining to see WW and Rogue.
>
> Spider-Man vs Superboy - Spider-Man was the victor
> in a pretty boring fight

I didn't care for this one at all and I don't think either is worth the waste of time to ponder. But styles make fights and the Spidey Clone has it in spades.
>
> Wolverine vs Lobo - Wolverine won a ridiculous off
> panel victory.

Lol! Really, I don't think anyone would argue for Wolvie.
>
> Captain America vs Batman - Batman won on a fluke
> when a water main broke and he hit the distracted
> Cap in the head with a batarang after a fight that
> had lasted hours.

Ugh, Batman vs Cap..... looking closely, it was a no brainer. Bats was tired and Cap was fresh and clean! No one can convincingly argue that a tired Bats beats a fresh Cap! Popularity wins again.
>
> Non fan vote fights:
>
> Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an Orca
> on Namor.

Since when did Aquaman have super strength (before the contest) and since when does Namor have trouble lifting an orca? Talk about poor writing! One punch from Namor and that blond overgrown goldfish is suchi!
>
> Jubilee vs Robin - Robin won by tricking her with
> his cape.

Lol!
>
> Quicksilver vs Flash - Flash won this one even
> after Pietro sucker punched him after Flash
> stopped to save a kid and his dad from death.

True enough, no competition.
>
> Thor vs Shazam - Thor won by disrupting the
> lightening that gave CM his power with Mjolnir.

Thor wins, but this version of Shazam is what does him in. But OG Captain Marvel wins every time.
>
> Silver Surfer vs Green Lantern - Silver Surfer won
> after a cataclysmic clash of power.

No contest....ever!
>
> Elektra vs Catwoman - Elektra absolutely schooled
> Catwoman here. Dropped her off a building.

Thief vs martial arts master......? No brainer here.

In the end, no matter how off the results were, the final tally was as it should be...MARVEL WINS!

Daikumanoken Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an
> Orca
> > on Namor.
>
> Since when did Aquaman have super strength (before
> the contest) and since when does Namor have
> trouble lifting an orca? Talk about poor writing!
> One punch from Namor and that blond overgrown
> goldfish is suchi!
> >


Actually Aquaman has ALWAYS had superstrength. He's just so overshadowed by Superman, Wonderwoman, Martian Manhunter, Captain Marvel, well you get the idea. He stregth falls in the RM-IN range in comics. Which means Namor OWNS his tail! And like you said, when is it that the Submariner cant lift a 7 ton orca??? The guy can lift 75 tons when he's on dry land!!!! I still want to puke whenever I think of that battle.

Mr Happy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Daikumanoken Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an
> > Orca
> > > on Namor.
> >
> > Since when did Aquaman have super strength
> (before
> > the contest) and since when does Namor have
> > trouble lifting an orca? Talk about poor
> writing!
> > One punch from Namor and that blond overgrown
> > goldfish is suchi!
> > >
>
>
> Actually Aquaman has ALWAYS had superstrength.
> He's just so overshadowed by Superman,
> Wonderwoman, Martian Manhunter, Captain Marvel,
> well you get the idea. He stregth falls in the
> RM-IN range in comics. Which means Namor OWNS his
> tail! And like you said, when is it that the
> Submariner cant lift a 7 ton orca??? The guy can
> lift 75 tons when he's on dry land!!!! I still
> want to puke whenever I think of that battle.

Well, I guess your right, but I meant strength on the levels that we commonly see Namor, Wonderman, Hulk, Thing, you get the picture. Plus, I didn't really take the time to figure his ability to swim should give him some strength increase or he would be a slow sea snail and fairly ineffective as a sea king!

Quote
Punstarr
Hulk vs Superman - Superman won after a hard battle and black eyes.

Storm vs Wonder Woman - Storm won this one by continually pelting WW with lightening bolts.

Spider-Man vs Superboy - Spider-Man was the victor in a pretty boring fight

Wolverine vs Lobo - Wolverine won a ridiculous off panel victory.

Captain America vs Batman - Batman won on a fluke when a water main broke and he hit the distracted Cap in the head with a batarang after a fight that had lasted hours.

Non fan vote fights:

Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an Orca on Namor.

Jubilee vs Robin - Robin won by tricking her with his cape.

Quicksilver vs Flash - Flash won this one even after Pietro sucker punched him after Flash stopped to save a kid and his dad from death.

Thor vs Shazam - Thor won by disrupting the lightening that gave CM his power with Mjolnir.

Silver Surfer vs Green Lantern - Silver Surfer won after a cataclysmic clash of power.

Elektra vs Catwoman - Elektra absolutely schooled Catwoman here. Dropped her off a building.

It's strange how Robin, a mere kid sidekick, had the brains to use his Bat rope to tie Jubilee up when it didn't occur to Wonder Woman, an A Class superhero to use her lasso to tie Storm up. The object of the game was to either tie up your opponent or knock him out. The way things went, Robin understood the game better than Wonder Woman did.

Superman vs. Hulk is always a non-fight. Hulk can't fly. Superman throws Hulk into space. Game over.

Quote
ThatArtGuy
Superman vs. Hulk is always a non-fight. Hulk can't fly. Superman throws Hulk into space. Game over.

That is how cosmic-powered Spider-Man beat him.

Quote
Thrudjelmer

Quote
ThatArtGuy
Superman vs. Hulk is always a non-fight. Hulk can't fly. Superman throws Hulk into space. Game over.

That is how cosmic-powered Spider-Man beat him.

That was more of an accident though, Spider-man still didn't realize how strong he was at the time when he punched the Hulk into orbit.

Unintentionally or not, that still knocked Hulk out of the fight.

Quote
Punstarr
Fan voted fights:

Hulk vs Superman - Superman won after a hard battle and black eyes.

Storm vs Wonder Woman - Storm won this one by continually pelting WW with lightening bolts.

Spider-Man vs Superboy - Spider-Man was the victor in a pretty boring fight

Wolverine vs Lobo - Wolverine won a ridiculous off panel victory.

Captain America vs Batman - Batman won on a fluke when a water main broke and he hit the distracted Cap in the head with a batarang after a fight that had lasted hours.

Non fan vote fights:
Namor vs Aquaman - Aquaman won by dropping an Orca on Namor.

Jubilee vs Robin - Robin won by tricking her with his cape.

Quicksilver vs Flash - Flash won this one even after Pietro sucker punched him after Flash stopped to save a kid and his dad from death.

Thor vs Shazam - Thor won by disrupting the lightening that gave CM his power with Mjolnir.

Silver Surfer vs Green Lantern - Silver Surfer won after a cataclysmic clash of power.

Elektra vs Catwoman - Elektra absolutely schooled Catwoman here. Dropped her off a building.

Superman should win this one easily.

WW should kill her in short order.

Unless it is a different Superboy than I know, Peter goes down hard.

Cap all the way. I don't think that it would even be a close fight hand to hand.

Namor beats him. Not sure by what margin.

I will call Jubilee/Robin a draw. This one is a bit like Penguin vs Egghead.

Flash in a landslide.

Thor, with or without the lightning trick.

Norrin, unless someone knows something about Hal that I don't.

Elektra.

I have an idea.
Because comics, write up an encounter that results in an improbable victory. I have taken it as my mantra ever since Stan Lee said the debate of who would win is pointless because the character that will win is who the script writer wants to win.

So if you think the Hulk would beat Superman, write a little short about how he does it. Try to stay as close to canon as possible but remember this is comics, one in a million odds happen with regularity.

I will take part in this too... gotta research Lobo to find a way for Wolverine to win the match up.

Anything is possible. But some fights are more uneven and the victor more easily decided. It's probably why they chose the match ups they did for the vote... they could have written those either way depending on the vote, but other fights were easier to let the writers just decide who wins because it would be harder to fit in the improbable victory. I mean, Catwoman beating Elektra? Very improbably possible... but easier to just give that win to Elektra because she was the better fighter. Catwoman vs Black Cat would have been a more suitable match up for a vote win... on the other hand, taking the vote away from the readers allowed the writers to also give the unlikely hero the win, as in the Aquaman vs Namor matchup, because logically there is no way Aquaman should have won and definitely not in the way they scripted it.

Points for Marvel & DC teaming up for such an epic crossover effort... but they lose those points and more for the crappy execution. On the other hand, they did make up for it with the merged Amalgam universe (sorta recurring in two additional miniseries later on).

How Hulk beats Superman: Loeb writes it.

Actually Superman tends to have a negative reaction to hard radiation such as the kind discharged by a nuclear weapon. The Hulk has been described as emitting from a slight increase to background rads to a walking Chernobyl. It also gets stronger as he does. Gamma is a hard radiation that would be along those lines. So even being in the vicinity of the Hulk could cause heat stroke like symptoms and the action of striking or lifting the Hulk could be like you touch a hot skillet. Just saying