Could be the worst Marvel film. Rotten Tomatoes for better or worse has it at 11%.

Taarna Wrote:
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> Rotten Tomatoes for better or worse has it at 11%.


Thrudjelmer likes this.

If the movie tanks, I'm sure FOX will drop it and Marvel can bring it back in. And then do it justice.

Taarna Wrote:
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> Could be the worst Marvel film. Rotten Tomatoes
> for better or worse has it at 11%.


TAG likes this too, unfortunately.

It's down to 9% now.

I don't plan on wasting two hours or so of my life watching it.

And I *LOVE* the Fantastic Four. It could be such a good movie if done correctly.

TAG

Taarna Wrote:
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> Could be the worst Marvel film. Rotten Tomatoes
> for better or worse has it at 11%.


I read on Facebook that the unreleased version produced by Roger Corman in 1994 got a better rating on Rotten Tomatoes. I looked it up and lo and behold, it has a 33% rating:

[www.rottentomatoes.com]



I also read that the director of the current FF movie is already badmouthing it, saying the studio was behind the changes and that he had an idea in mind that would have gotten better reviews?

[www.hollywoodreporter.com]

How professional of him. I'm sure it was Disney's fault he was let go of the Star Wars spinoff movie he was supposed to direct too.

video: [video-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net]

TAG

Marvel doesn't want FF. They have no intention of doing an FF movie if they get the rights back.

As for this latest one, I haven't seen it yet, but I'll post my thoughts in due course.

Maybe Marvel could, if they get the rights back, do a Doctor Doom movie with the Fantastic Four as supporting characters.

Thrudjelmer Wrote:
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> Maybe Marvel could, if they get the rights back,
> do a Doctor Doom movie with the Fantastic Four as
> supporting characters.
That would be a great idea. Doom is more interesting than the FF and one of the most popular comic bad guys ever. He could become the major baddie in the movie verse after the infinity war ends.

I am going next weekend. I despise critics. If I think it sucks hind teat I want it to be because I think so not because some one else tells me I wont like it. I liked Batman Forever over Burton's Batman movies. And I liked the FF movie with Chris Evans but not the Silver Surfer sequel. I loved X-Men 1 & 2 but wish X-men 3 had never been made.

I got a free ticket when i bought my copy of X-Men Days of Future Past: Rogue Edition.

Okay so I am going to give a (I think...) Spoiler free mini-review.

So, I just got back from the Fantastic Four, I got a free ticket as I wouldn't have (and glad that I didn't...) pay to see the movie. If this was a movie about five random people given tremendous powers and them learning to deal with, just like Chronicle (the other movie directed by this director...) and it had nothing to do with Marvel characters who have been around since '63, then it would have been an 'Okay' film.

It's sad to me that Hollywood has NOOOOOOOOO clue what they are doing with these movies, I had read a review which suggested that it was as though there was a 30 minute snippet of the film that was somehow left out. I couldn't agree more, because while I got what was going on (read the background and computer screens they flash at you...) a little bit of exposition and at least 30 more minutes of something resembling a plot and character interaction would have done wonders for this film.

Here is the skinny, they had a great cast with wonderful actors who given a better script could have made this a damn good film. They gave Johnny and Sue something to do and reasons to even be there, I loved that part...but the fact that they screwed the pooch during the second act leaves me wondering who is to blame: 20th century Fox for hiring Josh Trank or Trank for trying to step into a game he just wasn't ready to play?

Okay, having seen it... I really liked it. The ending was rushed, and there were clearly some continuity issues (mostly related to the fact that the studio decided to write off the whole thing halfway through production). But on the whole I think there is more good than bad here.

The cast was great. Franklin Storm was especially good, and there's a great scene (albeit short) between Franklin and Johnny that resonates generationally. More on that later.

The emotional heart of the film is definitely there. The trope of a super science experiment gone horribly wrong is common for super villain origins, but here it works for the heroes too... and as someone who feels that Reed Richards has both heroic and cowardly sides to him, I feel this movie back me up on BOTH counts.

I will now give some spoilers. These are minor, and are more of an explanation of what you see than spoiling it completely, but I will tag it:

I recommend this movie as a complete reimaging of the Fantastic Four. If that is not something you're interested in, I completely understand if you want to skip this. It will not be what you want, and I don't fault you. With my personal history on these boards, I feel like most of you will already know that I give film adaptations a wide berth. If I give the Ant-Man movie an 8/10, I would give this FF movie a 7/10. The thing is, as much as I personally wish it were different, the FF is not summer blockbuster material. I admit that. It's for a niche audience. But if you're cool with a science-y movie that's kinda sorta an FF movie too, I would recommend this at least as a freebie when it comes to Netflix or HBO. Let me also say that if your mindset is "screw all that", I completely understand and can sympathize with that too. If you want something faithful to the Kirby/Lee FF, I cannot emphasize enough that this is not for you, nor should you apologize for that.

Now, I alluded to the racelift earlier, and I just want to mention that fully half the audience at the screening I went to were black nerds who obviously bought tickets to go see this by themselves. Holy crap! Even with my familiarity with Nerds of Color both online and off, I had no idea how underserved they were by comic book movies. Seriously. If this movie does $30 million on opening weekend, which Fox would consider a total bust, at least $15 million of that is due to black nerds.

Now, I cannot in all honesty revoke my defense of those who object to racelifts. But I feel it's worth mentioning that Hollywood in general, and Marvel and DC I particular, really need to take notice of this, and stop ignoring the monetary potential that is out there. Did Static outsell Batman? No, and we all know that. But it really seems to me that comic book sales, for a variety of reasons, are not the best judge of minority interest in these kind of movies. There are huge $$ out there just waiting for some studio executive to realize that Dwayne McDuffie is alive and well in the hearts and souls of fans who want original superheroes of color.

This concludes the social justice part of this review.

As the resident FF fangirl I would say there is a reason to like this movie. But as you might remember, I gave X-Men First Class positive reviews and I haven't watched it since, so you know by now to take my opinion with a grain of salt.

If I had to put myself in the shoes of the regular posters here, I'd give this FF 4/10. And some of you would give it lower. But I liked it and will watch it again.

Thank you for taking the time to write that review, FTJ.

I'm curious about how they handled Ben. You didn't really mention him.

There's some good stuff with Ben, but since he's not recruited into the wiz kids think tank, he drops out of the picture for a while, until the origin story requires him to be involved again. That part feels forced, but of course Sue and Johnny being on the space flight was forced in the original version, so I can forgive that.

ThatArtGuy Wrote:
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> And I *LOVE* the Fantastic Four. It could be such
> a good movie if done correctly.
>
> TAG


Me too. I'm a huge FF fan, but the terrible review, combined with the movie going off script is going to make me wait until its on HBO.

I thought my $10.00 had already been spent in July. I'm glad Stan Lee did not make a cameo in this mess.

Thrudjelmer Wrote:
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> Maybe Marvel could, if they get the rights back,
> do a Doctor Doom movie with the Fantastic Four as
> supporting characters.


Doctor Doom has been essentially ruined in these movies. All of them.

I think Rutger Hauer could make a great Doctor Doom equalling or perhaps equalling Sir Ian Murray McKellen Magneto.

One can only hope. I'd pay big money to see Triumph and Torment become a movie, Dr. Stange and Dr. Doom. against you know who. Quite possible Marvell's best graphic novel...ever.

Rutger Hauer was my friend's choice for Magneto around 94 or so.

TAG

Taarna Wrote:
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> Thrudjelmer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Maybe Marvel could, if they get the rights
> back,
> > do a Doctor Doom movie with the Fantastic Four
> as
> > supporting characters.
>
>
> Doctor Doom has been essentially ruined in these
> movies. All of them.
>
> I think Rutger Hauer could make a great Doctor
> Doom equalling or perhaps equalling Sir Ian Murray
> McKellen Magneto.
>
> One can only hope. I'd pay big money to see
> Triumph and Torment become a movie, Dr. Stange
> and Dr. Doom. against you know who. Quite
> possible Marvell's best graphic novel...ever.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I've never really cared for his portrayal of Magneto. He's not supposed to be unrepentantly evil like they showed him in the movies. The comic Magneto would have used the machine himself in the first movie and would have never abandoned Mystique the way he did in the third movie.

Those are writer problems, not actor mistakes. *shrug*

ThatArtGuy Wrote:
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> Those are writer problems, not actor mistakes.
> *shrug*

The point is I was never wowed, like when he played Gandalf. I think I'm also the only person in the world who hated Heath Ledger's Joker.

Punstarr Wrote:
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> The point is I was never wowed, like when he
> played Gandalf. I think I'm also the only person
> in the world who hated Heath Ledger's Joker.


I suddenly feel very invisible. I mean, how much of a fuss did I have to raise about all of the Batman movies in general to get noticed? And Ledger was one of my main complaints about the first movie.

More and more people are now willing to admit the Nolanverse was overrated.

I honestly think a lot of people gave more weight to Ledger's performance because the guy died.

Punstarr Wrote:
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> I honestly think a lot of people gave more weight
> to Ledger's performance because the guy died.


Yes, no one was allowed to criticize out of respect for the dead.

Ledger's Joker is as valid as Romero's, Nicholson's, or Hamill's versions. It was a perfectly fine interpretation based on the setting that was set by the writer/director. It was a great performance, but I will say that the best Batman movie still has the best Joker in it: Mask of the Phantasm.

I was so happy to see it in the theater.

TAG

Back on topic:

[www.craveonline.ca]

TAG

It seems like there was a reluctance for a long time to let the FF move beyond a silver age aesthetic. The 90s adaptations seemed out of date even when they were first made.

‘Fantastic Four’ is ‘The Room’ of superhero movies


When I saw how “Fantastic Four” was ranked on Rotten Tomatoes, I ran straight to the theater. Eight percent fresh? I wondered. But how? Was that even possible? That was south of Congress and genital herpes.

Now I know why. It was like Tommy Wiseau directed a superhero movie. It was like watching the Fox News GOP debate, but without the plot, stakes or cheery presence of Donald Trump. Whenever something crashes and burns this badly, it deserves a closer look. What went so wrong?

One of the elements of Wiseau’s horrible classic “The Room” that makes it such a masterpiece is how doggedly it sets up situations and set pieces that are familiar from other films. Love scenes. Fights. Football? But then it doesn’t understand why those set pieces work. How do you show that two people are in love? Well, I don’t know. How about they tell each other, repeatedly, that “I’m crazy about you.” How do you know they’re upset? I don’t know, how about they shout “YOU ARE TEARING ME APART, LISA!”

This was like that.

Usually, superhero movies contain certain tropes and elements

There’s life before. There’s the event where you gain powers, usually accompanied by a loss of some sort. There’s a montage where the characters learn how to use their powers. Then, after they fail once (but learn, bond and grow in the process) they succeed a second time and we all go home happy with stomachs full of popcorn.

Loosely, this is the superhero movie structure. Even if they don’t contain all of those things, usually they at least contain a couple of key elements, like someone to root for, or a plot.

“Fantastic Four” was above these things.

It wasn’t like they threw out the baby with the bathwater, in the editing room. It’s as though they made an explicit point to keep the bathwater and lose the baby.

It was like the executives behind it asked themselves the following questions:

What if we removed all the parts of superhero movies that people enjoy and just had a lot of footage of people staring at computer screens waiting for things to load?
What if we made a superhero movie where we just SKIPPED the year when the team discovers their powers?
What if we cut out the part where the protagonists bond, do you think the audience would mind?
What if the big scientific discovery of the movie is something that an 8-year-old boy built in his garage in the first 10 minutes but I guess it took almost a full hour of movie time and more Movie Science to rebuild it bigger?
What if we literally had a science teacher so bad that when the hero teleports something during a science fair, he says “YOU ARE KICKED OUT OF THIS FAIR BECAUSE WHAT YOU DID WAS MAGIC, NOT SCIENCE”?
What if the hero got a scholarship to something called the Baxter Institute or Baxter Foundation but the movie never explains whether it’s a school or a lab or an orphanage or what?
What if The Thing didn’t wear pants?
What if the entire climax is fought in a CGI land where there are no clear rules or stakes, so much so that someone has to keep yelling what everyone is doing and why because otherwise you have no idea what’s going on other than there is a lot of blue flashing light?
What if Kate Mara’s special genius skill in the movie was pattern recognition?
Seriously, pattern recognition.
What if literally someone goes to Kate Mara at a key moment and says WE NEED SOMEONE WHO CAN RECOGNIZE A PATTERN, would that be good? Is that the kind of drama people have come to expect?
What if instead of having characters reveal themselves through action, we just had them tell each other what their motives were, saying things like “You look really in your element.” or “No, this is your home.” or “This is what you’ve always wanted.” or “I know why you’re doing this.” or “Let me tell you who you are.”
What if the villain’s power is he can kill everyone just by thinking about it, but then when he gets to his home planet where his powers are strongest, he can’t?
What if the final climax of the film is someone saying “TEAMWORK! THAT WAS WHAT WE WERE MISSING!”
What if someone unironically says, “Please, Victor. We’re not gods.”
What if the film includes a scene where Miles Teller carries a big stack of books over to Kate Mara in a library, pulls out “Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea,” and says, “They have great books here. This is my favorite book. In it, a man named Captain Nemo builds a submarine! It goes deeper than anything has ever gone.”
What if our main romance is two people whose chemistry could best be described as Two People Who Both Want To Leave The Room Because They Are Running Behind But Don’t Want To Be The First To End The Conversation Because That Would Be Rude?
What if their most romantic exchange goes as follows:
“I’m adopted,” Kate Mara says.
“I know what that’s like,” Miles Teller says.
“You’re adopted?” Kate Mara says.
“No,” says Miles Teller, “but I wish I were.”
What if nobody develops powers or does anything until about an hour has gone by?
What if we made a superhero movie with all the urgency and stakes of your grandmother, on the phone, retelling her trip to the grocery while she putters around the house?
What if the heroes had to recruit the assistance of a Clearly Evil person whose last name was Von Doom and who says subtle, ambiguous things like “I don’t think humanity deserves a second chance”?
What if the basis for everyone getting powers was that they all got mysteriously drunk off a single tiny flask and Miles Teller decided to call up a friend whom he hadn’t seen for months (days? years? the timeline is never clear) and take him with them to another dimension and nobody blinked an eye? They all just nodded and said, “Sure, bring your non-scientist friend into our secret lab, slap a suit on him (we’ve got a spare suit, I guess!) and let’s travel interdimensionally.”
What if their motivation for doing this was “everyone remembers Neil Armstrong but no one remembers the scientists who sent him”?
What if Kate Mara brings them back by doing that “hacker” thing where your hands go clickety-clickety-clack over the computer keys frantically to “override”?
What if when they come back some blue energy goes BOOM so she gets powers even though she did not get to go get space drunk with the boys, because perhaps she had seen “The Fly” and knew better than to just hop willy-nilly into a teleporter?
What if Miles Teller just disappears for a year?
What if the last word of the movie was someone about to say “Fantastic Four” but they cut to credits before he could actually say it?
What if we made a superhero movie where one of the climactic moments was Miles Teller very slowly pulling his arm back into his sleeve?

“Fantastic Four” is the answer to all of these questions. I would call it a trainwreck, but “Trainwreck” was actually good. This was . . . something else. I’d see it again, at midnight, if they let me throw spoons at the screen.

By Alexandra Petri