I've got to go with the Jedi on that one, all the way.

Alien. just because i hate star wars.

Next Generation/ DS9 era Federation vs Star Wars Episode IV -V era Empire
Tech wise here is how i break things down
Artificial Intelligence i give to Empire, droids were every where in SW

Small Star Ships i give to SW I think Runabouts are probably tougher than Tie fighters but i think Ties would have the numbers

Travel i give to SW i thing Hyperdrives are much faster that Warp drives it seems in SW every one was jumping from one end of the galaxy to the next in a matter of days and weks were in Trek it seems to take months

Small Arms i give to Trek, phasers seem much more powerul than blasters

Shielding goes to Trek, I remember the NG Enterprise met an alien ship armed with lasers and they said the lasers would not be able to damage the shields....dont know if this would apply to a turbo blaster

captial ships over all i thing a Star Destroyer would be more powerful than a Galaxy class starship

The interesting piecve of tech that i think would give the Empire touble would be the transporters, Until they learned how to shield agaisnt it. being able to transport troops around would be a big advantage. I rememberr in a Star Trek novel that was about the Enterprises very first mission, it beat an alien ship that overpowered it by using the transporter to transport the ships warp core out of its containment field causing it to explode.

Well as a bit of exceptional timing from Marvel I can inform you that Cronos has definitely got at least one appearance in Marvel Comics (The Titan that is) in the recent Hulk Vs Hercules one-shot so is no longer a no-show.

he has been in flash backs before the Hulk vs hercules was the appearance i was talking about where i felt herc took Cronos down to easy

Battle of the teleporters!

This is a tough one to choose for me, so I'll wait and hear what others have for arguments first.

The Last Duskblade Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Battle of the teleporters!
>
> This is a tough one to choose for me, so I'll wait
> and hear what others have for arguments first.

I'd go with McGill Feighan (from The Journeys of McGill Feighan series by Kevin O'Donnell).

McGill is a "Flinger", a person who can teleport anything (himself, other people, things) anywhere that he's been before (so he didn't necessarily need to see his destination, just be sufficiently aware of it). One trick was to teleport drugs from a syringe into the person who was trying to inject him. At first, he, like all other Flingers, has a mass limit of no more than 918 kg/2,023 pounds (plus his own mass), though by working in convert with other "Flingers" they can exceed this limit. However, McGill discovers something no other "Flinger" has: a Flinger's powers work by accessing a dimension where momentum energy can be added/subtracted so the teleporter or items teleported can match the velocity of the destination and not keep the velocity of the source location. (Thus, he can safely teleport himself/others out of a falling plane, or from a relatively still position into a moving vehicle, and not get smeared.) McGill also learns to tap this extradimensional energy for all sorts of telekinetic-like effects, like giving items a gentle "shove" (or accelerating them to 25,000 mph). He also discovered he could "Fling" people "away," typically into outer space (he discovered this one by accident when he got very angry with a teacher).

Theoretically, he could probably generate a force field (draining projectiles of all momentum) or blasts of raw kinetic force; unfortunately the series was never finished so there's lot of implied untapped potential.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2008 02:50AM by Dr Archeville.

I would pick Nightcrawler, but Blink is formidable too. NC is comabt skilled, but B's teleporting is not limited. NC can only do it a few times before even he is exhausted. If he grabs her, it'd the end of the night! One or more successive teleports and hse is out! Well, that's the theory!?

Hmmm, a good point but we don't know how Nightcrawler's version of teleportation compares to Blink's since she seems to have none of the concerns with physical exhaustion or causing damaging trauma when teleporting someone unlike Nightcrawler. She only seems to run into problems when taxing herself near her limits and it doesn't seem to affect anyone she teleports just her. Nightcrawler on the other hand is while adapted to it just as at risk of teleportation exhaustion even over short distances as anyone he teleports, it just doesn't hit him as hard. Blink might find herself just as badly affected by his brand of teleportation as a non-teleporter and if so if he could get the drop and teleport her first using his trademark multi-port attack he could inflict considerable damage, perhaps enough to even take her out. If he can't she's got a range of deadly attacks possible with her teleport spears and comes from a ruthless timeline and killing isn't beyond her or at least maiming an opponent if that's what it takes to win.

I think Blink in the end has the edge as she's grown up in a war zone and unlike Nightcrawler has spent nearly her entire life in a do-or-die setting and raised by an alternate version of Victor Creed as a result. While he's had hard times and fought grand battles it's not part of his mindset like it is part of hers.

Whereas if you use the Marvel stats listed on this site for Nightcrawler, there's no way Blink wins. Then again, there's no way Kurt wins either. Both have Intuitions far too low to consistently hit one another. Both have the heading of "Subject must succeed in a Monstrous/Unearthly Intuition FEAT or Nightcrawler/Blink will have teleported away".

I really wonder about that option at times, it seems to make it too hard to nail them when they've been nailed fairly often in the comics. Neither has a Danger Sense or other related power to avoid ambushes or attacks from their blind sides. I think it might make more sense to consider them to have an initiative bonus against attacks and if they beat the initiative of their opponent they then teleport before being hit. It makes hitting them more realistic given the kinds of people who've gotten the drop on them.

Nightcrawler with a Danger Sense = one scary mofo.

Danger Sense+Rapid Teleportation does make for some serious trouble nailing someone, although I'm sure someone somewhere would find a way around it.

Any thoughts on how either of those two would do against Vanisher? He's not a character I'm familiar with at all, other than the game write-up of course. But I've never seen him in an actual book. Could he take either of X-Men teleporters?

probably not. he was always kind of a low rent thug who could teleport. but he never seemed to have the finesse or number of applications that any of Xavier's students have.

Vanisher straight up does not know how to fight. He'd run away in any given encounter rather than face his foe.

Mr. Porter does seems to be lacking in the needed skills to face of with either of those other two. When you say that he would run, it makes me wonder if a teleporter like Blink or Nightcrawler, could chase him successfully. Or are they just as limited as anyone else when trying to chase somebody who can teleport? A fight is one thing, but what if Kurt really needed to get something from Telford, that may be much more difficult.

I think the main issue there is that while both parties can teleport, neither has any inkling of the others' teleportation destination. Ie, when the Vanisher teleports away, Nightcrawler won't know where to teleport to give chase.

That's where I'm at too. The only way it would work is if, by being a teleporter, they have the ability so see traces of energy or whatever that tell them the general direction. That would be a pretty cool power stunt for someone with Energy Detection or the like. Has there even been an example like that in the comic, where someone was able to track the direction of a teleport.

Well it's an established part of Vanisher's power of teleportation that no one can come with him he doesn't want although they can try and use their own teleportational powers if grappling with him to try and follow him. Unfortunately this can cause problems as we saw when Nightcrawler tried it and they had a disastrous trip through other dimensions as their powers reacted in unpredictable ways. It's possible that Blink attempting to teleport along with Vanisher could have a similar or worse disaster and if he's just teleporting where she's watching him teleport she has no means of tracking him to otherwise give chase (and as has been pointed out Vanisher would just teleport somewhere so far away he couldn't be found since he can teleport blind without risk of injury or death).

I think there have been a few occasions where an energy manipulator could track someone teleporting (Magneto's done so to Nightcrawler) although it's likely subject to the kind of teleportation involved for what kind of energy signatures if any it left behind. Vanisher's psionic teleportation might not leave a trail whereas Nightcrawler's and Blink's would as they're interacting with reality in different ways to teleport.

Even psionic powers give off energy of some kind, at least I think. In any case, I like the idea that who can track a teleporter depends on how the character in question is manifesting the teleport. In any case I think it would be a cool power stunt for someone with Psionic Detection, Energy Detection, or something else feasible.

Yes it does allow for some interesting possibilities. Magneto could track Nightcrawler because his teleportation disrupted the magnetic lines of force (at least I remember that being the reason) so that as he left one location to appear at the other Magneto could sense him coming out ahead of time and nail Nightcrawler as he came out. He might not have such luck with Vanisher however or be able to block his teleportation as he probably could or has with Nightcrawler. Depending on the mechanism a lot of powers can be transparent to others, just like psionic detection won't pick up on normal radiation and vice versa. Since none of the listed teleporters have any means of detecting energy, teleportation or otherwise, they wouldn't be able to track each other or anticipate an attack. They're just as vulnerable to an attack from a teleporter as anyone else (much like a sniper has no inherent protection against other snipers just because he's a sniper). In the end it comes down to conventional combat and who's a superior fighter (of which Vanisher would lose to both in a single turn of combat unless he comes back after some intensive combat training).

There are a few of these I wonder about specifically, but feel free to add your own.

Firelord vs. Terrax

Fallen One vs. Morg

Red Shift vs. Air Walker

i think firelord and terrax would come down to where the battle was fought if it was fought in space i give the edge to firelord but it if was fought on a planet then i think terrax would take it

I think Morg with the combined powers of the well of life and power cosmic would beat the fallen one, in thaqt form he beat most of the past heralds at once, but but if he only had one or the other powers then i think fallen one wins

I think Red Shift would beat Air Walker with ease, While Red Shift didnt seem one of the most powerful of heralds, Air Walker IMO besides Johnny Storm was the lamest herald

dacat75 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> i think firelord and terrax would come down to
> where the battle was fought if it was fought in
> space i give the edge to firelord but it if was
> fought on a planet then i think terrax would take
> it

Very true. Actually I didn't think about the environmental benefits for some of those guys. Nice call.

> I think Morg with the combined powers of the well
> of life and power cosmic would beat the fallen
> one, in thaqt form he beat most of the past
> heralds at once, but but if he only had one or the
> other powers then i think fallen one wins

True again.

> I think Red Shift would beat Air Walker with ease,
> While Red Shift didnt seem one of the most
> powerful of heralds, Air Walker IMO besides Johnny
> Storm was the lamest herald

It's interesting that some of the heralds work for more depth with their Power Cosmic than others. The robot incarnation of Air Walker was always a desperate thing for me, even when he was present during the Herald Ordeal and Annihilation. Just kind of pathetic, and it seems like with the kind of power flying around, he could have rebuilt his body like brand new.

So for the next consideration:

Stardust vs. Nova

star dust vs nova is hard to for me to call because im not sure of the full extent of stardust powers, being a being of energy she has shown the ability to reasimble herself after being disintigrated, and nove has been killed so i guess stardust could just keep comming back until she finally won, but i must admit im not really sure how powerful she is

Not meaning to distract from the cosmic tussles listed before, but I wanted to say that I think Blink has an edge on Nightcrawler in tenacity but Nightcrawler has an edge in sheer fighting ability. I can not give it to either fighter so easily. As far as Terrax and Firelord, I am not sure Firelord ever had enough power to bother Terrax? I'd pick Terrax regardless, I mean consider his origins and his history, I don't see Firelord winning. In space or on land he can easily call in random chunks of space debris to distract FL like Vader did to Luke and lights out for old Flame-head!

With Morg and Fallen One, I don't know what Fallen One can do but I hate Morg so I pick Fallen One here. Lol! For Red Shift and Air Walker I never liked either but Air Walker [the Robot] is fairly weak, so I can't imagine him doing very well. With all this considered, I can't really say which one should be the winner with confidence as so little is known about them.

How do you think the A-Next Avengers from the M2 universe would do agaisnt the Current Avengers teams for those who might not be familiar with A-next i gave a brief description of the memebrs

A-next team
American Dream daughter of Sharon Carter wears costume and has simualr abilities has captain america
J2 -son of the Juggarnaut simular powers
Bluestreak-mutant speedster
Kate Power adult version of the power pack member
Saberclaw son of wolverine healing factor adamantium tipped claws
Thena daughter of Thor, goddess of lighting
ThunderStrike son of the original wields the thunderstrike mace

I think this team would take luke cages avengers team just based on the heavy hitters on A-next although Wolverine vs his son would be good
A match would be interesting with the Mighty Avengers alot of heavy hitters in this battle with Wonderman, Ms Marvel, Sentry, Ares going up agaisnt J2,Thena, and Thunderstrike to witch i give the edge to the Mighty Avengers
American Drean vs Black Widow could be ineteresting but i think the Widow would take it
I think the adult form of Katie Power could shut down Iron Mans armor if she caught him by surprise
Bluestreak seems simular to quiksilvers so i think he could take the wasp

I'm pretty sure the Might Avengers would crush A-Next, but I agree it's a much closer fight with Cage's group. Especially if Thor's daughter is packing Mjolnir, I'd say that seals the deal on those boys, and even ups the chance of an upset with the Mighty team.

If all the stats we available, these would be interesting to play out.